- This topic has 81 replies, 53 voices, and was last updated 2 years, 8 months ago by
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I needed this lesson so much! Thank you for really explaining sett and how the drape and hand of the fabrics we weave can change with the sett. I’d always just used the recommended epi that came with the cone of fiber or what was on the chart in my weaving book, but now I see that I have control over all of this. I will watch this episode over and over again, because there is so much in it. I’m so glad that I signed up for your online guild. It is terrific!
Thank you, thank you, thank you!! -
I’m rewatching the videos on sett. It’s so wonderful to have this review. I’m wrapping different yarns on a ruler to achieve the recommended sett. For some reason (I think it is a vision issue) I just cannot judge the distance in space needed to allow for the weft yarn. I seem to fall very short on EPI. I can wrap very tight side by side and eventually get wraps in the range needed. They do not overlap but they are tight. Is it ok to test the epi without leaving the space if I can’t get it right? Am I the only one that has this problem? Betty
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This is not what you want to hear, Betty – but, in order to establish the right sett for the yarn you are testing, you need to leave the space for your weft yarn in order to get your balanced cloth. If you don’t, you will get a very dense piece of cloth. Do you have a magnifying glass – maybe one of the ones you use on your head or one on a stand that could help you see the space between each thread for plainweave, for example. If you are using the more common yarns for your project, you can just depend on Jane’s Master Sett Chart for plainweave and twill.
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You are a very fine teacher, and I am learning a lot. Even though I am using a rigid heddle loom, I find many of the lessons have applicable tips that I can use. Your class was recommended to me by another customer I met at a weaving shop and I don’t even know her name. But I am grateful for both of you.
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I just finished my first warp of 4 (well, 3-and-a-half) dish towels in 8/2 cotton at 20 epi. I just could *not* get 20 picks.. more like 18. I thought there was something wrong with me! Since the product was advertised to be used at 18-24epi, I had figured I was “safe” with 20. Looking forward to seeing what 18epi looks like.
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Jane, your wrapping technique to determine sett is right on!! Although I have woven for several years, I always have trouble believing the wrapping divided by 2 and end up looking at yarn charts to figure out what sett to start sampling with. Your method of actually duplicating the weave spacing that is in the woven item makes so much sense to me. Thank you!
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I just received over 5 lbs. of 20/2 cotton in Navy, pale blue, chocolate and taupe. I’ve weaved with 20/2 wool for a tartan but never with cotton that small. I’d like to make a shawl or wide scarf. (just watched the episode on plaids and so want to dive in :] )Do you think that starting with 30 epi is a good place to start? Thanks
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Thank you Jane for your lessons. I am still Learning, have only woven dishtowels after my daughter warped the loom and did her 6 towels for the guild in Calgary. Then I had enough warp left to do two cloths of her pattern. I am hooked. So much better than reading books on weaving. I seem to get a brain block trying to understand by just reading. After watching your lessons it is so clear and I know I’ll be back to play it over and over. Thank you again! 🙂
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Jane, you refer to the first cotton as 4/8. Is that the equivalent to US 8/4 cotton? Love you oodles!
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I have several cones of 10/2 mercerized cotton that I want to use for napkins. This size isn’t on the Master Sett Chart.
To get a crisp fabric in plain weave, what sett would you recommend?
Thanks so very much for this Online Guild! Even after 3 semesters of college weaving classes, I’ve learned and understood an enormous amount of info AND am learning how to free my inner creativity especially in Season 2. You are a godsent.
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Good morning, Tessa. Jane’s Master Sett Chart is comprised of yarns that she has used consistently over a long period. If a yarn is not there, she suggests wrapping the yarn around a ruler to establish a sett that would work for you. If in doubt, I would make my warp longer, sett it at what your ruler suggests and weave a couple of samples changing the sett in-between. Wash and dry the way they would normally be used and check to see which sett you like better. I know – sample, sample, sample 😉 You would then have samples to keep, showing how different setts work with your 10/2, which is a win-win.
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Oh boy there is so much to learn and take in. I think I will be going over and over these lessons. My question is that I have a 8 shaft table loom with no treadles but paddles on top, will you be showing how, instead of tieups on treadles, use the upper paddles correctly? Thankyou for all the work you have done to being this teaching tool to us. It is starting to make good sense with clear and concise teaching from you Jane.
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Hi Sandra, it sounds like you have a table loom, where each “paddle” lifts one shaft. In your case – if you want to weave Plain Weave, you would lift up both shafts 1 and 3, throw your shuttle, beat, beater back, return 1 and 3 to resting position, lift both 2 and 4 and repeat, over and over again. For Twill, you will lift 1&2, 2&3, 3&4 and 1&4 – manually lifting the shafts you would need to make the shed you need next for your particular cloth.
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Great video! So informative. The one part I’m confused about is when you want to warp a thicker thread and weft a thinner thread or vice versa. For example, if I have 8/2 Cotton for warp and want to try 30/2 silk in the weft, then I wrap the ruler with cotton, leaving space for fine threads of silk? Does that end up in less EPI than PPI and is that ok? Or should I just use a 20/2 silk that is closer in size? When Jane is leaving space for the boucle, I don’t understand how that would still have the same number of PPI as the cotton EPI if it is bigger and lumpier? Super beginner weaver here! Thanks!
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Hi Danielle, 8/2 cotton with 20/2 silk is yummy. You’ll have a chance to place with sett and different yarns next season with different samples. I, personally, love the feel of the organic 8/2 cotton and 20/2 silk together. If you want to use 30/2 silk as a weft, I’d warp with 16/2 cotton or 40/2 linen. You will have so much fun next Season after you get the fundamentals “under your belt”!
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Very informative and now I have more information to make decisions regarding sett and the kind of cloth I want. I had been setting warp by consulting a chart: 8/2 cotton or cottolin sett at 20, 24. But now, I can decide to change that if I want a different fabric. That sett is probably great for dish towels, but what if I want to make fabric to make a shirt? I would probably want to open it up a bit.
Now the question I have is for hand painted warps. For the color in the warp to stand out, I usually sett my warp closer: 30 for twill (that’s what is on my loom now), but maybe that is a little too close. How would I manage to get a nice fabric for a shirt? My dream is to make a shirt with an ikat dyed warp. Needs to be close enough for the colors to appear solid, but not so close as to be stiff. I would probably use 10/2 cotton instead of 8/2.
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Hi, Deborah. I’ve been thinking about your question and two things come to mind. One – it pretty well depends on what kind of skirt you want to make – there are so many options, summer weight, fall weight, lined or loose. You would almost want a different sett with any of those options. I love painting warps and dyeing of any kind. I look forward to seeing a photo of your ikat warp.
The other question was about sett for 10/2 cotton. We don’t use much 10/2 in our particular world. Jane carries the yarns that she loves, trusts and knows inside out. So in cotton – it’s 16/2, 8/2, 8/4 and 8/8 unmercerized cotton. Yarn choice, the weight of cloth you want, the cloth that appeals to you in your finished product – they are all in your realm of choice. I would wind a sample warp of the yarn you would like to use and then do samples (including finishing) with it until you get the cloth that speaks to you.
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Just to clarify, I want to make a shirt, not a skirt with the fabric. Relatively light weight spring, summer.
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Hi. I’m new to the guild and am loving it!! So many questions have been answered as I watch the videos.
I bought a HUGE cone of cotton thread from a weaving shop that was changing hands. It was manufactured at the Wehadkee Mill in West Point, GA. The mill went out of business around 2004, I believe.
Here is my question: it is a 6-ply cotton thread. The label indicates it is 750/6 and that there are 4 lbs. on the cone. Could the 750/6 numbers possibly be correct? I used my ruler to figure out EPI and came up with 10. Should I try both an EPI and PPI of 10?
Any help would be appreciated! Thank you.
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Hi, I am relearning set and have never really used cotton although I have woven for many many years. In the last section on set you spoke about changing a 2/12 cotton from 24 epi to 60 epi to make it warp faced – did you use the same weight cotton for the weft? If so, what picks per inch please – would it be 60? Thank you.
Also could you point me to a chart which would show the different e.p.i. in different ways. I live in France, order from the UK, and they all do different epi. Also are you using ordinary cotton or mercerised?
Thank you.
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I have an 8/2 boucle warp of 365 ends. I originally warped it up for the Blackberry Waffle pattern and then realized I’d accidentally used the boucle instead of regular 8/2. Made up the correct warp and the tea towels worked out beautifully!
Now, I’m dressing the loom with the boucle. I’m trying to figure out the correct epi so the towels won’t be too wide and still be a nice weight. Usually I make up the boucle towels with 262 ends, 22″ in the reed. The Sett chart shows the epi for boucle is 12 and it’s 18 for the 8/2 towels. Do you think an epi of 15 for the 365 ends of boucle would be all right? Then I would sley a 12 dent reed 1-1-1-2. I’m thinking they’d be approx. 24″ wide but wonder about the weight.
Thanks for any advice – I’m hoping to get it right the first time! -
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Hello Jane and firstly a big thank you. I’m binge watching, learning loads and enjoying it massively.
On behalf of other international guild members my question is, would you please consider making metric versions of your master set chart and reed substitution chart for those of us who use cms? I personally have a sectional beamed loom with 1cm divisions and my one and only reed is 3percm.
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Hi Melissa. There is a Blank Master Sett Chart for you to use to create your own. We Canadians are an odd lot and live in both the Imperial and Metric world at the same time – officially our country tried to turn to metric in the 1970s but it wasn’t 100 % successful. 😉 My warping mill measures in yards, but my loom is metric! Our rulers and measuring tapes have metric on one side and Imperial on the other. Most of us move back and forth between the two methods of measure, depending on what we are doing and what system we learned as a child. All the pattern measurements are in inches and yards, so you could add those as notes to your chart.
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Thanks Sandra, yes the UK is equally ambivalent about metric/imperial measurements and we still use miles and stones, but also cms and kgs and have two-faced rulers too. However, I’m sure many of Jane’s fans are using metric as her audience is international so it would be very helpful to provide both measurements, no? Making conversions is definitely confusing and even with a calculator in hand it’s easy to make mistakes – eg: I think 16 epi would equate to 6 ends per cm or thereabouts, not 25 as you said above 😉
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Thank you for catching that, Melissa! I will take my calculations out of the post 😏. I’m one of the people who is hard wired in Imperial as well as slightly dyslexic when it comes to match, so I shouldn’t have answered your question with those kind of details. I apologize. 😔
Members from the Guild are from all over the world, with access to yarns and other weaving supplies that are different from the ones that we have in our corner of the west coast of Canada. Jane’s hope with the Online Guild is to give us the tools to fly on our own, creating our own cloth with the yarns available to us. Not everyone has access to 8/2 cotton for instance, but they do have access a ruler – whether in metric or Imperial – to work out how many ends per cm or inch their particular yarn will be “happiest” at using the structure they plan to use. Creating your own Master Sett Chart, for the yarns you have access to, in whatever method of measurement you are most comfortable with, IMHO, is still the best way to go.
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Hi Jane,
I going to try to weave the double weave sampler from Jennifer Moore’s book on my 4 shaft wolf baby loom using 8/2 cotton -pattern says use 8 dent reed but I only have a 10 dent and 12 dent reed. The pattern calls for 32 epi (18 epi for each layer) width in reed 9 inches. Thread dark on 4, light on 2, dark on 3 and light on 1.
I used the 10 dent reed –according to the reed substitution chart 32.5 epi– I would be sleying heddles I would sley heddles 3-3-3-4 or if I used 12 dent reed at 32 epi; I would sley heddles 2-3-3. How does this work with double weave? on 10 dent would I sley 3 light color, 3 dark color, 3 light color and 4 dark color? on 12 dent- would I sled 2 light color, 3 dark color, 3 light color and 2 dark color?
Thank you,
Just a little confused
Tamara Hackley
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How amazing is this lesson?! Absolutely fascinating! I’m picking up a brand new Louet Jane soon (I’m beyond excited!), and this comes with the standard 10 dent reed. What is the advantage of having a 12/15 dent reed against just sticking with the 10 and using the chart to determine your sett?
I am so enjoying this course – I just don’t have the hours in the day to do enough weaving!!
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I’m wondering the same thing. If I’m doing a balanced plain weave, could I not just measure a half inch on the ruler? It seems more precise than eyeballing the spaces. And likewise, for a twill, could you measure/count 2/3″ to get the 2 and 1 ratio? I’m very, very new, so apologize if I’m missing something or being overly particular!
Loving the course and materials so far – thank you so much!
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This is so interesting ! I had NO IDEA that I wanted the holes (neg. space) in my project !!!! Do the neg. spaces in towels affect the absorbency ?
Can I sneak in another little question here since I have your attention?
I have a 12 dent reed that came with my Ashford Floor loom…. is there another size you would suggest for the future? I really am interested in weaving some kind of rag rug placemats (8/4 cotton warp ) Can I do that on this loom? is it heavy enough? (I don’t really understand that lingo, I read it somewhere)
Thanks
Barbara
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I’d go with an 8 – but you can check Jane’s Reed Substitution Chart and see which reed would give the widest variety of possible setts.
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The best thing to do is to watch and place every pic allowing for the negative space that Jane describes in the video you just watched. As you go forward, you will see examples of Jane doing just that as she weaves 😉 You’ll master all the tricks of weaving overtime time and practice, Carol – welcome to our world!
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I’ve just done a series of samples on my Louet Jane loom using 8/4 (4 ply) cotton. I started at 14 epi/ppi then down to 12 epi/12ppi and finally 10 epi/ppi. Interestingly, the 10 was the trickiest as I had to use a light but consistent beat.
The difference in drape and feel is amazing – I would highly recommend this little exercise as it’s given me a real feel of the new loom. The selvedges were quite poor though, and I suspect that this was down to trying to weave too near the reed – more frequent advances would have prevented variable tension in the warp as the ‘angle’ of the shed increased as it got shorter
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Heavens. This is what I’ve been missing.
Couple quick questions:
- What’s the width of Jane’s metal ruler?
- Is the boucle she is using here cotton or rayon or other?
- Is the 8/2 cotton she uses the same as our 8/2 cotton in the U.S.?
Please forgive if these were already answered above. I tried to read it carefully for that but didn’t see them.
Thanks in advance!
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Hi June,
Jane’s ruler is a basic typical one so probably 1 1/2″ wide I’m guessing? As for the 8/2 cotton she uses and the US one, they have the same setts so you’ll be fine using either.
Here’s the links for the boucle which is cotton and the 8/2
https://janestaffordtextiles.com/product-category/yarns/cotton/8-2-cotton/
https://janestaffordtextiles.com/product-category/yarns/cotton/boucle-cotton/
Also, in a few more episodes in Season 1, Jane talks all about yarns that you’ll enjoy watching 🙂
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I’ve been following along since the first episodes with a warp for tencel scarves. I was amazed at the difference in beaming my loom immediately! I put on a 5 1/2 yard warp for two ‘sample’ scarves in 10/2 hand dyed tencel sett at 30 epi in a twill pattern on 32 harnesses. After completing the first scarf, I decided to cut the warp and see what would happen if I changed my sett to 36 epi. The pattern is much more pronounced. As I’m watching this episode, I’m thinking that I would like a softer/’drapier’ fabric on my next project. In the past, when I would set the tension on my warp to weave, I would get movement in the weft threads in the tension on the breast beam which would create unspeakable gaps in my weft threads in the finished product. I did not experience that with my most recent project where I had used books for creating constant tension on my warp while beaming it. I’d like to try setting my epi with this 10/2 tencel at 30 again for the next warp but am a bit fearful of getting some slippage in the weft threads on the breast beam when the warp is under tension. Do you think that perhaps that was caused by uneven tension in the warp threads while beaming or too loose of a sett in warp threads in the project? Again, I did notice a significant difference using the method with the books.
Looking forward to your response! I’m having so much fun!
Shannon Wittman
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Hi Shannon,
Jane talks about a similar issue in another episode, but you’ll have to jump ahead to Season 3 Episode 2. This is from the index btw 🙂
-weaving the Cramming & Denting Sample #1 – Cotton Warp at the Loom, 3.2.2
-cloth distortion over the breast beam 3.2.2, 15:13
Not sure if this will help you but might give you a few ideas.
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I am so glad that I joined this guild! I made a table runner and was really confused about sett and you have explained it with reasons. One book said one way and another said some other way. No explanation as to why! It makes sense now, and so I can go forward and make my next project! thank you so much!
Can I still get a kit for the season 2 projects?
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It’s great, isn’t it, when the pieces start falling together, Jocelyn 😉 And yes – you can get the kits for Season 2 by heading to the Shop and clicking on Online Guild Sample Kits
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After looking at the Master Yarn chart, I notice there are 3 numbers at the end of each write-up for that yarn. I gather they refer to the sett that you can use, but…………… to which pattern does each number belong?
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The Master Sett Chart lists yarns that Jane uses in her world and the setts she has found 5hat work, from her personal experience. For 8/2 cotton, for instance, she suggests setts that would give you a variety of results in Plain Weave and Twill. I’m not really sure what your question is – could you please rephrase it so maybe I can understand what isn’t clear to you?
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I’ve finished 2 seasons of this amazing course but I’m placing this question here because it has to do with sett. After working yards of warp on jst 8/2 cotton set at 18epi, I’ve learned that I can’t get better than 16 ppi no matter how hard I beat or loosen the tension. I’m using an ashford table loom. I can adjust my picks accordingly to make squares, etc. Going forward into the next seasons, should I be readjusting the epi with this knowledge? Should I bring the epi for 8/2 cotton to 16 for a balanced weave? How should I approach the epi for jst 8/2 cotton for twill? And for the upcoming lessons should I lower the epi for the other types of the yarns? I will be starting denting and cramming next. Thanks
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I’ve tried that. Unfortunately when I do that my shuttle torpedoes. I’ve read it a common issue w ashford table looms. Any suggestions either regarding the torpedoing or the sett adjustment? Thanks.
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It can be frustrating when your shuttle dives 🙁 All I can say is that it’s all about practise throwing your shuttle, adjusting your tension and finding the sweet spot in your cloth. I doubt that it is because your table loom is an Ashford – I have a Woolhouse and it happens on it and it sometimes happens on my Louet David as well if I’m not paying attention! Do you hold your shuttle the way that Jane demonstrates – pretending you are drinking a cup of tea????
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what an amazing video I have never been shown how to use the ruler for each yarn like this shown always been told wrap and half now I can have fun dying all my white yarn and wrap it round knowing that if i leave a space for my weft thread i can weave anything and use up all my yarn. I’m so pleases this course was recommeded Ive learnt so much already.
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Hi I very much enjoyed your information on setts. I am not sure if I missed this .
If I use more than one warp thread thickness ie 2/8 and 4/8 how should I determine the sett?
Same kind of question about various threads in weft.
It is not something I have tried, but I thought of this as I was rereading your chat.
Thank you so much these sections are helping me a lot.
cheers David
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You’ll learn more about sett, and how you can change it up to get different effects, when you start learning about the samples in Seasons 2 & 3. If you are doing stripes of 8/4 and 8/2 in a piece – your example – you would sett the 8/4 stripe at ½ the number of epi as you would your 8/2. You would have to decide how many ppi you would need to get the desired outcome you are designing for.
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