Episode 7: Tell us what you think :>)

Forums Weaving Discussion Online Guild Discussion Season 1 – Foundation Episode 7: Tell us what you think :>)

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    • #32886
      Sandra
      Keymaster

        To quote Jane (who is actually taking a few days off)

        Hi Kids,   Let me know your thoughts 🙂

      • #32889
        Gabriele
        Participant

          So many good informations and ideas (-: about yarn, thanks

        • #32910
          Suzanne Labreche
          Participant

            This episode came at the right time as I need to weave items I promised while using my stash. Being able to combine different types of yarns and gauges is invaluable in making my decisions. Much appreciated.

          • #32941
            Kathy
            Participant

              Another great and informative episode! Every lesson leaves me wanting to learn more and more!

              I am so greatful to have this online guild available to me! Thank you!!

            • #32947
              Ed Chapman
              Participant

                Great fun! I particularly enjoyed the silk segment. I did not know there were different kinds of silk moths- but it makes sense. When you have a thousand year old industry there is bound to be some diversification! Looking forward to more videos.

                PS. Jane’s store is remarkably well laid out and easy to use as a website. Video #7 inspired me to branch out of my comfort zone and a new fiber.

                • This reply was modified 6 years, 11 months ago by Ed Chapman.
              • #32970
                Debbie
                Participant

                  Is the count for silk 840 as is in the PDF or is it 500?

                  2/30 silk has 7500 ypp.  Using the formula (Size x count ) / ply = ypp

                  Then rearranging to solve for count

                  Size * count = ypp * ply

                  Count = (ypp * ply) / size

                  then plugging in the numbers:

                  count =( 7500 *2)/30 = 500

                  Does it make a difference if we are talking about silk noil versus spun silk?

                  • #32979
                    Jane
                    Keymaster

                      The count for silk is 840….oh my, did I say 500 in the video?

                      Silk noil does not count in this system as it is made of left over stuff :).  Only the long fibre silk works out at 840.

                  • #32981
                    Debbie
                    Participant

                      You are good.  You said and wrote in the PDF that silk has a count of 840.

                      But I’m still a little confused.  Using the formula and using 7500ypp for 30/2 silk the count would be 500.  7500 ypp is given for your 30/2 silk and other vendors too.   Is the formula different for silk then?

                       

                      • #32988
                        Jane
                        Keymaster

                          Hi Debbie,

                          You are right.  High Five!  I should have checked all those numbers out but it must be 500 because everything works perfectly at 500.  Thanks so much for letting me know.  I’ll change that sheet and maybe we can put an edit on the video saying….oops 🙂

                          Great work.

                          Jane

                        • #32990
                          Jane
                          Keymaster

                            Hi Debbie,

                            I have been looking in all my books at the count system and everywhere I have looked it gives the count for silk at 840, but I have never bothered to do the math because I know the yardages of the silk we use.  This is very interesting indeed…..none of the math works out at 840.   It does work out at 500.

                            That is crazy 🙂

                            Didn’t I mention in the video that all these numbers drive ya nuts !!!!!!!!

                            I am going to copy this over to the new thread on Silk Count.

                            I’ll keep looking.  If anyone else finds anything please post it 🙂

                            Cheers,

                            Jane

                        • #32992
                          Regina Noble
                          Participant

                            As always, this was another great episode.  I am a fairly new weaver and as such am just starting to branch out of making everything from a kit.  I love the kits – so quick and easy – but I am starting to look at all the yarn I already have with an eye to “what could I do with this”  or “where would this be most practical”.  I have had many project ideas start to come to me, things for the house, things to wear, etc and this video helped me to start looking at the various yarns as well as how to use them to achieve the result I want.  Up to know, it has been trial and error…and you know, that usually means error!!

                             

                            One other thing I love about these videos is all the little ‘teasers’ Jane throws out there.  “We are going to do this later” or “We will do a video about this topic next year”.  Makes me feel like I need to try and master each month’s topic so I am ready!!!

                          • #32993
                            Deborah
                            Participant

                              Another great episode.  I had to wait to watch this and it was worth the wait.  I have been trying to get a sense of the Count system so that segment was particularly helpful as I spin my own fibre.  Now I know what count it is.  Thanks for showing all the samples – also very helpful.

                            • #32994
                              Debbie
                              Participant

                                Hi Jane

                                What a puzzlement!

                                You got me looking into this too.  I did some Googling and some looking in books.  It becomes very technical very quickly with talk of reeled silk in Deniers versus spun silk.  Several sources indicate ~500 ypp (A Silk Workers Notebook by Cheryl Kolander, Treenway website http://www.treenwaysilks.com/kc-yarnsblends.php),

                                However, The Art of Weaving by Else Regensteiner (pg 34) indicates that the formula is different for spun silk…..the ply is ignored…..yardage is computed based on number of 840 hanks.  the number of plies does not matter.

                                silk 30 singles = 30 * 840 = 25400

                                2/30 silk also has 25400 because it was 2 60 singles that made it 30 weight

                                 

                                someplace I read “the count numbers describing reeled [silk] yarns are complex technicalities of trivial interest”.  Further supporting what you taught us:

                                It isn’t the numbers but the diameter of the thread compared to the other threads we are using in our project.  If it visually looks the same then sample with it!

                                Sorry to have gotten us into a bunch of snarly technicalities.  Eyeballing it will be so much easier 🙂

                                Thanks Jane!

                                Debbie

                                • #32996
                                  Jane
                                  Keymaster

                                    It is great to be having these conversations because it points out that there are so many systems out there and it gets complex quite quickly.  And there is conflicting information which makes it even harder to understand and I’m the first person to put my hand up when you ask the question…”are you easily confused” LOL.

                                    Sampling has always answered my questions regardless of anything I read and I always keep notes about what I did.

                                    In regards to EPI I have used 30/2 silk at setts as open as 15 EPI when I’m using it as the non shrinking element in my collapsed pieces and as high as 32 EPI in multishaft twills where the float length is longer and many places inbetween depending on the type of fabric I want to create.

                                    SO ….the only thing I recommend is stay open to all ideas.  But use your eyes and don’t be afraid to re-sley 🙂

                                    And….I am so happy we are using the forum for this type of discussion.

                                    THanks Debbie

                                    I am thrilled you brought it up.

                                • #32995
                                  Deborah
                                  Participant

                                    I am trying to use your Master Sett chart to determine my starting point for some handspun merino I plan on using in my warp and weft.  In order to compare it to the Harrisville Shetland you sell, I needed the ply/count.  I am assuming it is 2 ply.  Using your formula (solving for size rather than yds per pound), there are 1800 yds in a pd of Harrisville  X 2 ply / 560 for a size of 6.5.  Is that correct?  I have spun 2/13 with merino so am thinking to use 18 EPI and 18 PPI.  Seem OK?

                                    • #32997
                                      Jane
                                      Keymaster

                                        Hi Deborah,

                                        It seems a tad high to me.  I use Harrisville which is a 2 ply at 10-12 for twill and 8-10 for plain weave because I want it to have room to bloom when it is fulled.  Have you tried wrapping a ruler like I describe in the episode about sett.  Even when I wrap a ruler, I only consider it a place to start and I do a sample, wash it and the readjust the sett if I need to.

                                        Sampling is never a waste.

                                        Let me know if this makes sense or not 🙂

                                    • #32998
                                      Debbie
                                      Participant

                                        Hi Jane,

                                        I think I found the answer to silk counts in Marguerite Davison’s Pattern book! Page IX

                                        There is the French System, and the English system.

                                        In the English system,  silk standard is 840 ypp (same as cotton).  But the formula is different – ply is ignored.  The finished yarn only is used in the calculation.  Therefore a silk 50/1 and a silk 50/2 both have 4200 ypp ( 840 * 50).

                                        In the French system there are 1000 meters in a kilogram.  After converting from metric we get 497 yards per pound which is pretty close to 500 YPP.

                                        Why the silk manufacturer’s are using the French system is a mystery.

                                        Debbie

                                        • #32999
                                          Jane
                                          Keymaster

                                            What an awesome little researcher you are…..I would have given up long ago.

                                            I passed on all my information to you kids from way back in my school days…(like the late 70’s)  never checking it out because I don’t really use that stuff…but everyone is always asking me to explain it.

                                            I’m so glad you kept searching.  It makes sense that I was given all the English counts.

                                            I will move your post to the thread I created about the count on silk.

                                            It will be great for everyone to read 🙂

                                            Thanks a bunch.

                                            Hey do I know you….are you a Debbie from my past, LOL.

                                             

                                        • #33001
                                          Debbie
                                          Participant

                                            Hi Jane,

                                            Glad I could help.

                                            No I am not a Debbie from your past, but a Debbie from your future.  I’m in your Color and Design class next week.  Can’t wait!  See ya then.

                                            • #33002
                                              Jane
                                              Keymaster

                                                So cool.  I am really excited now 🙂

                                            • #33302
                                              Jessica
                                              Participant

                                                As a spinner I would quibble a bit about the remarks about mill-spun and handspun yarn.  They are not categorically different.  When we look at any textile made before the 18th century, and many in the 18th and 19th centuries, all yarn used was handspun and had the same range of qualities (pretty much) as current millspun and handspun yarn.

                                                When a spinner talks about a worsted yarn being harder, it doesn’t mean that it is rough or hard, but rather that it is harder than a woolen spun yarn made from the same wool would be.  The softness of a yarn, its luster, etc. comes from the interaction of the fiber itself and how it is prepared and spun.  You always work within the range of possibilities of the fiber — woolen spinning cannot make a rough fiber soft, and worsted spinning cannot make a matter fiber lustrous, but worsted spinning can really bring out the luster of a lustrous fiber.

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